| Author |
Message |
    
Sweetsunray
storyteller
Username: Sweetsunray
Post Number: 1171
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, December 16, 2006 - 12:42 pm: |     |
turns out that the higher the IQ the greater the chance that the person will eat less meat or decided to become a vegetarian as a young adult. Smart choice according to investigators since it lowers the risk of cardiovascular diseases
http://health.yahoo.com/news/170005
Perhaps Bear ought to change his sig in
vegetaraniasm = the smarts' choice 
Everyone has a motive for giving arguments. But only the arguments given matter. |
Da_bear
flint knapper
Username: Da_bear
Post Number: 873
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, December 16, 2006 - 3:10 pm: | |
From the article:
Given these factors, "we cannot draw any solid conclusions from this research," Sandon added.
Keepin th sig baby
If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice. |
Sweetsunray
storyteller
Username: Sweetsunray
Post Number: 1173
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, December 16, 2006 - 6:38 pm: | |
Hey, it was worth a try 
But at least after taking into account the known factors, there was a significant correlation. 
Everyone has a motive for giving arguments. But only the arguments given matter. |
Da_bear
flint knapper
Username: Da_bear
Post Number: 874
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, December 16, 2006 - 9:27 pm: | |
I don't doubt it, but what does this do to the supposition of more meat eating made us evolve larger, smarter brains, if veggies are NOW the correlation?
If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice. |
Sweetsunray
storyteller
Username: Sweetsunray
Post Number: 1174
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, December 17, 2006 - 5:56 pm: | |
Ah, but the correlation isn't that eating veggies make you smart, but that smart people will eat healthier, more balanced, less fat.
Also, note how the research has to do with making that decision when the people are young adults, that is when their brain has already developed.
And as a joke: perhaps the smarts need less meat than others
Everyone has a motive for giving arguments. But only the arguments given matter. |
Scott
flint knapper
Username: Scott
Post Number: 1714
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Monday, December 18, 2006 - 5:20 am: | |
But isn't that axiomatic? At least informed *and* smart people will.
Scott
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Ces gens, Jondalar, ils sourient. Ils me sourient. - Ayla |
Bats_out
bear cub
Username: Bats_out
Post Number: 17
Registered: 12-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, January 23, 2007 - 9:10 pm: | |
"We know from other studies that brighter children tend to behave in a healthier fashion as adults --"
Yes, and children with genius IQs are more likely to:
drop out of high school
engage in sexual activity earlier than their peers
have social anxieties
become serial killers
etc, etc.
I'm not sure how much of the dietary mumbo jumbo I buy. |
Sweetsunray
storyteller
Username: Sweetsunray
Post Number: 1196
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 12:40 am: | |
Bats_out: become serial killers
LOL, never heard of that one. Probably because it's not true. Most serial killers are of average or a bit more IQ intelligence. "Genius" IQ and serial killers is highly overrated and a Hollywood myth.
As for the rest, just from anecdotal experience... only the social anxieties as a child and the being a vegetarian fits. The hs drop-out is only a possible outcome of boredom. They might as well have been going great at school, but seem a failure when it comes to holding a job. Wasn't bored during my studies, but bored into a burnout at work. It was about that time (27) my mom urged me to take the test.
Everyone has a motive for giving arguments. But only the arguments given matter. |
Bats_out
bear cub
Username: Bats_out
Post Number: 19
Registered: 12-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 2:43 am: | |
Well I was being somewhat sarcastic, however, high-IQ offenders do fill a very specific role in criminal profiling. On the other hand, serial rapist/killers usually have low IQs. On average they're something like 8 or 9 points lower to average.
And from my experience, those things fit. I've been tested multiple times. In these tests my IQ has always been somewhere between 168-172. I dropped out of High School. I dropped out of college. (twice actually). I have all sorts of social anxieties and weird issues. I can't hold a job to save my life. I guess thats why I'm a writer, lol. But alas, I enjoy meat very much.
Moms are funny. Mine tried getting me to join Mensa. |
Scott
flint knapper
Username: Scott
Post Number: 1773
Registered: 5-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 6:12 am: | |
What kind of writer?
I neither dropped out of high school nor did I become a serial killer or learn to toss off before my peers did! Definitely not mensa material. I eat a lot of meat too. That confirms it, I really am a Neanderthal! Where is sidescraper_gal when you need her? Get a DNA kit, we didn't go extinct!
Scott
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
Ces gens, Jondalar, ils sourient. Ils me sourient. - Ayla |
Hitman84
gatherer
Username: Hitman84
Post Number: 116
Registered: 9-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 12:16 pm: | |
bats_out et al.
I'm a vegetarian mostly because I'm addicted to spicy Indian food.
I dunno if I'm MENSA material but may be I'd make a good FBI agent. Thanks to all the detective novels, movies I've watched over the years etc..
Psychology is an important aspect of computer science and chess, I like reading about psychology mainly because I can identify business tricks.
In some countries they use psychology for marketing absolutely everything and you can blame it on commercialization. Statistics can be misleading here...
Education helps you "understand" the truth.
Psychology can "force you to believe" anything as the truth.
In case of criminals they have their own beliefs and with their vast experience they'd have learnt numerous ways to defend their beliefs(which itself might change with different experiences)
You'll be surprised to know that psychology was actually used in ancient days when Kingdoms were trying to conquer one another. Religion was the power tool(I'll write more on this on the concerned thread when I find time)
This is why "good" education is very important! It gives you exposure/experience in a civilised environment and more importantly it teaches you to face reality.
These days they check your EQ(emotional quotient) as well in job interviews.
My Chess Blog
" I failed to make the chess team because of my height " - Woody Allen |
Sweetsunray
storyteller
Username: Sweetsunray
Post Number: 1198
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 4:13 pm: | |
We had to do an IQ test as 14 year olds...At the time it showed me as above average, but no mensa level... Well, I was already regarded as the nerd in class by my peers and for the last two years I sabotaged tests to score less than I could on purpose. And I did the same thing when they took that test in the classroom with every pupil of the class present and hadn't specified to us that the results would be kept private.
Mom got suspicious in my 20s when she learned how much time I spent debating, and because of the verbally discussed results from an IQ test during a job application (no figures mentioned, but a description of the zones 5+, 5- and one or two 4+) Mom who had worked at school counseling centers knew enough to become suspicious with that... So, I'm Mensa because I took the Mensa test, whether I pay a contribution or not. Mom thought it would be good for me in the sense that she hoped that I would be able to meet with others there to debate physically aside from the net. But alas, Belgian Mensa clubs so far fall in the range of collecting matches, or cigar boxes... not really my kind of thing.
Some puzzle pieces did fit after the results (especially the boredom at work), and it also is a big help for me when I teach... Gives me the insight to be patient with pupils. I've told some friends about it, and some of them took the test too... similar results.
Everyone has a motive for giving arguments. But only the arguments given matter. |
Bats_out
bear cub
Username: Bats_out
Post Number: 21
Registered: 12-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 11:50 pm: | |
Scott,
a little of this, a little of that. Poetry is my passion, but it doesn't pay the bills. Children's lit, greeting cards, whatever.
Sweetsunray,
Had similar sabotage attempts as a kid. Funny how people can be so similar just from something so insignificant as an IQ. When it comes to Nature vs Nurture, I always fight for Nurture to win, but she keeps letting me down. My mother also thought I should join Mensa for the contact with other, uh, "people." Like you, I'm not a big fan of cigar boxes,  |
Sweetsunray
storyteller
Username: Sweetsunray
Post Number: 1200
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, January 25, 2007 - 12:07 am: | |
I didn't care about IQ, only had learned not to give it my total best on tests. I did a mix of doing good enough of my best to satisfy my parents, and yet some underachievment so not to be noticed too much, so that the other kids couldn't call me a streber no more. Wasn't about IQ or intelligence, but about social acceptance. And well the latter seems an insignificant issue to me nowadays.
Everyone has a motive for giving arguments. But only the arguments given matter. |
Hitman84
gatherer
Username: Hitman84
Post Number: 117
Registered: 9-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, January 25, 2007 - 7:22 am: | |
I guess there are different types of IQ test..
http://www.faqfarm.com/Q/How_many_different_types_ of_IQ_tests_are_there_and_how_do_they_vary_from_ea ch_other
This is a cool test!
http://www.mensa-test.com/
My IQ range 120-140.
In Singapore they have fast track schools for children having superior IQ.
My Chess Blog
" I failed to make the chess team because of my height " - Woody Allen |
Sweetsunray
storyteller
Username: Sweetsunray
Post Number: 1201
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, January 25, 2007 - 3:26 pm: | |
There are at least two scales used with the tests, and the number result says little unless one knows which scale it is. What may be 160 for one scale may be 130 for the other, and both would be the 2% percentile.
The test I did, was not related to language. It used nothing but symbols and pictures. So, it didn't matter what language you spoke. And yet the test was able to test your underlying language skills, through images. And actually it were two tests of each an hour, with a 15 min break in between for controls. I must confess that at the end I had worked myself into a headache.
Everyone has a motive for giving arguments. But only the arguments given matter. |
Hitman84
gatherer
Username: Hitman84
Post Number: 121
Registered: 9-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, January 25, 2007 - 5:42 pm: | |
Bobby Fischer dropped out of school and had an IQ of
180+(stanford-binet scale) and had a very good retentive memory!, later was made to look like a criminal 
http://www.jlevitt.dircon.co.uk/chargen.htm
My Logical and mathematical skills are pretty good but my language skills are poor.
My Chess Blog
" I failed to make the chess team because of my height " - Woody Allen |
Jerrers
bear cub
Username: Jerrers
Post Number: 22
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 06, 2007 - 2:48 pm: | |
If you want the ultimate end of High IQ and social/career misfit, there's always Billy Sidis - look him up on the internet and wonder if having too high an IQ isn't as much or more of a handicap than having too low an IQ....
And as regards the original post, I saw that too and wondered how many veggos would be feeling smug. You could probably make similar claims for most distinct and controversial choices: openly gay people, atheists, you name it. Anything that isn't the default position, or that takes some extra effort maybe.
"Vegetarian diets are associated with lower cardiovascular disease risk in a number of studies, so these findings suggest that a such a diet may help to explain why children or adolescents with a higher IQ have a lower risk of coronary heart disease as adults," Gale said.
May help, maybe. But there are a ton of more obvious and clearer possibilities: higher IQ leads to higher income (no, not all the time I know, but how many people wearing paper hats and asking if you want fries with your order have post-graduate degrees?) which leads to better food (less of that "want fries with that?" crap for a start), better health care, less smoking, etc.
Incidentally, the BMJ article itself states:
The mean (SD) childhood IQ score for vegetarians compared with non-vegetarians
was 106.1 (14.7) and 100.6 (15.2) for men and 104.0 (14.1) and 99.0 (14.7) for women, differences of 5.5 and 5.0 points.
In other words, even if giving up meat boosted your IQ (which the study does not claim of course), it would only be by about five points. Not worth it, says I. And if I wanted a cheap dig, I could note that On average, vegans had a childhood IQ score that was nearly 10 points lower than other vegetarians: mean (SD) IQ score 95.1.... |
Sweetsunray
storyteller
Username: Sweetsunray
Post Number: 1219
Registered: 9-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 06, 2007 - 3:59 pm: | |
Ah, but Jerrers, I often do think of vegans as very silly
Being gay is not really a choice, so I don't see what it has to do with the others you listed (including vegetarianism).
Everyone has a motive for giving arguments. But only the arguments given matter. |
Jerrers
bear cub
Username: Jerrers
Post Number: 23
Registered: 2-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 06, 2007 - 5:40 pm: | |
I wasn't referring to being gay as such, but being very 'out' with it - in the lower socio-economic redneck trailer-trash areas, it would be far harder to be openly gay, but in the more educated areas it would be more accepted. That's what I meant: not if they were or not, but how open they could choose to be about it. |
Hitman84
gatherer
Username: Hitman84
Post Number: 143
Registered: 9-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, February 11, 2007 - 7:12 am: | |
--If you want the ultimate end of High IQ and social/career misfit, there's always Billy Sidis - look him up on the internet and wonder if having too high an IQ isn't as much or more of a handicap than having too low an IQ.... --
Thanks for heads up Jerrers.
He was a better ape than most of us.
I consider IQ as a number that determines our ability to ape!
My Chess Blog
"It may be that brain hardware has co-evolved with the internal virtual worlds that it creates. This can be called hardware-software co-evolution."
- Richard Dawkins |
Science Lab